It's a good time for the Pet Shop Boys. Forty years later West End Girls, the two are experiencing a certain revival. They released a new album, Nevertheless, one of their best of the last twenty years and perhaps ever. New fans are discovering them thanks to films like Saltburn and Strangers. They also got one of the status symbols of 2024: a beef with Drake, which he used West End Girls in All the Parties without any authorization.
Neil Tennant and Chris Lowe have been working together for 40-odd years without hating each other, giving up or even separating for a while. Emerged in the 80s thanks to strange hits that talked about sex and money, from Rent to Opportunities to What Have I Done to Deserve This?, the two were decidedly different: Neil was the affable singer, Chris the impassive synth man. They brought divas like Liza Minnelli and Dusty Springfield back to the radio, they published the electro-sleaze trilogy made up of Please, Actually And Introspectivethey peaked with Very from 1993, a fundamental album of so-called queer pop. Cardi B has always been a fan and proud of it. The perfect moment is enshrined in the scene of Saltburn in which Barry Keoghan sings Rent at karaoke.
They are both great conversationalists, they laugh, joke, put strange theories on the table, talk about the pop stars they love and giggle at the ones they don't. It's like talking to a comedy duo.
Nice new album. How do you keep inspiration alive after so long?
Neil Tennant: It's not that we think about it a lot, it's something we just do. And we do it for the pure pleasure of it, not necessarily to get to a record. For example, Chris didn't even know they were writing an album.
Chris Lowe: There was lockdown and we were looking for something to do, so we started writing. I only realized we were making a record when Neil wrote to me to decide the order of the songs. “We have the album.” He blew me away.
Neil: You're good at churning out music. There has always been this playfulness in our work, something childish. And then what could you do during the lockdown, a walk in the afternoon, prepare dinner, little else. All that remained was to write songs. It was exciting to receive emails from Chris with new songs.
Did you expect it to last this long? In the '80s you made fun of long-lived rock stars.
Neil: And we still make fun of longevity.
Chris: Or maybe we're looking for longevity.
Neil: We have never been interested in longevity. We just got there.
Chris: I always thought that pop songs would last.
Neil: We've been saying this since the '80s, see the light pieces from the '60s. The stuff that ages poorly is the stuff that's considered important, that tries to convey big messages. It is light songs that enter people's lives. They are the ones that are remembered years later.
Chris: What's that Neil Coward quote?
Neil: «Strange how powerful cheap music is». He knew something about it and people still listen to his songs.
People thought that West End Girls it was cheap. Forty years later it is a classic.
Neil: When we started working on the record we realized that West End Girls he was turning 40, which is a nice coincidence. We made that record in New York. When we started there were those who thought we were a New York dance group and deep down we felt a bit like that. We recorded at Unique Studios with Bobby O, Arthur Baker was in the studio next door. I was in the United States to launch the American version of Smash Hits, I interviewed Madonna who performed every Friday night at the Roxy ice rink. In the street people were breakdancing. We went to New Jersey to record One More Chance at Sugar Hill Studios. We started there, in New York.
How do you put the albums together?
Neil: We are prolific, in fact we always have a lot of B-sides. We think for a long time about the pieces to include on the records, we want to create coherent sound worlds. To end up on an album or even just to become a B-side a song must deserve it.
Chris: There is also another thing and that is that we don't like records that are too long, those with 20 tracks. You have to be able to put a record on and get to the end. We like 90 minute films and 45 minute records.
Nevertheless it lasts 43. You are not people for fillers.
Neil: The attention span has something to do with it. In the 90s they started making 65 minute records. Has anyone ever heard Erotica of Madonna in one go, from start to finish? There's some good stuff towards the back, eh, but who gets there? If it had been 43 minutes it would have been better. The best thing is when you finish listening to an album and say to yourself «wow, what was that?» and want to hear it all over again. Curious that they left the album for dead, right? Remember when the album died? You Chris didn't even know he was dead.
Chris: I'm not up to date.
Neil: Are you not up to date on what music critics are saying?
Chris: I only listen to singles. I only listen to new music. But I've always thought of our albums as collections of singles.
Is it strange to have so many young fans?
Neil: Strange, yes. You notice it when you're on stage. You travel the world and see all kinds of people. In Germany we have a mostly mainstream audience. In America he is a little younger. In San Francisco it's definitely gay. It changes from place to place.
One of your fans is Cardi B, who grew up with your music.
Neil: Because of the mother, right? We like Cardi B. In one of those TV talks (The Tonight Show of 2018, ed) said to a guy, an American comedian: «You look like one of the Pet Shop Boys». And it actually looked a little like what I looked like on the cover of Discography.
This is John Mulaney and he looks like one of the Pet Shop Boys…
Neil: I am one of the Pet Shop Boys and I confirm.
You and Cardi, the world is waiting for a collaboration like this.
Neil: I think so too. The ball is now in his court.
Speaking of young fans, many discovered you through the movies.
Neil: There are our songs in two recent films, Saltburn and Strangers. Rare thing, Rent is an integral part of the screenplay, while in Strangers we talk about memories and it is the topic of Always on My Mind. They usually put our songs in 80's gay club scenes. Enough. We don't license scenes like this anymore, it's too lazy to think.
You had beef with Drake. How did you find out that he had used West End Girls?
Neil: I was in the car returning from the supermarket. My brother called me to tell me that his son, my nephew in short who is a fan of Drake, asked him if I knew that he had used West End Girls. I pulled over and put her song on Spotify. We receive a lot of requests, but I really didn't remember this one so I wrote to our manager who confirmed that no, we hadn't given authorization. We wrote it on social media, it was the best way to draw attention to the matter. Within a quarter of an hour Drake's people contacted us apologizing. Ultimately the rights thing was sorted out without us hearing from Drake directly. But I like how he sings and I like his piece of him.
Chris: I would really like to know how he gets that sound from his voice. I'd love to hear you sing like that.
Neil: We never get there. We have to find out his secret. Maybe a pinch of Auto-Tune?
Chris: Yes, but there's some pathos.
Another duet the world wants to hear?
Neil: Hmm, I'm not so sure.
In 1989 There were certain songs by Taylor Swift that were reminiscent of your music.
Neil: I started listening to it assiduously during the lockdown. I bought three records of her in a row. One is that of her with The Archer, that I love very much (Lover), I must have listened to that song a million times. And the one done with the Nationals, which didn't impress me much. I prefer the Harry Styles record. Listen Harry's House and you understand I doubt what his are reference, we understand that he wants to seem a little strange even though he is a great pop star. Like that piece, as it's called, Japanese Restaurant Theme or something like that (the title is Music for a Sushi Restauranted). It's good, because pop is at its best when it tries new things. Going back to Taylor, I don't understand her 100%, to be honest. But obviously she's incredibly prolific and I love that she re-recorded old records to piss off whoever sold her masters. Great. Strange, but true, it's the kind of thing we would do in a similar situation.
Love Is the Law it's the grand finale of your album. You have always been the kings of the finals. What criteria do you use to choose them?
Neil: We love the latest songs. Usually it's a song that suggests we'll never make an album again, so as not to explode. Do you know what could be a nice compilation? The Last Songs on Pet Shop Boys Albums. I was reading a big biography of Oscar Wilde that came out just before the lockdown. After being released from prison, Wilde ends up in Nice and there he observes the sexual negotiations on the Promenade des Anglais.
Chris: Taking part in it, probably.
Neil: Without money it could have been a problem. However, the last song is inspired by this story. But it still sounds like one last song.
Reminds me King's Cross which closed Actually.
Neil: That's one of our best songs, that one. At King's Cross we shot the video of Rent, Derek Jarman directed it, but it's no longer the place we described in the song. Now there's Google and other tech companies, it's no longer the squalid hell hole it was.
Chris: And that they loved so much (laughter so long as to seem suspicious, ed).
Neil: We met Andrew Ridgeley there a few weeks ago. I had met him at a concert, but Chris had never met him before. Very nice guy. He was going to Sony in King's Cross for a Wham! meeting. The photo we took with him is the most popular ever on our Instagram, but by far.
One of my favorite Pet Shop Boys songs is The End of the World of 1990. In my opinion its time will come too.
Neil: Maybe they'll put her in a movie and she'll be reevaluated. Do you know who liked that song? To George Michael. To me, however, it never seemed like a great song. I had made “girl” rhyme with “world” again as in West End Girls and it seemed a bit lazy to me. But you know, it's a piece about a teenage crisis. We've all been there.
Chris: I still have them.
Neil: You said it.
From Rolling Stone US.